2nd wifes in China

Posted by maydella (679 days ago)

Hello out there,

I just wanna ask a question:

I am european guai lo stationed near Zhongshan in China. All of my friends from HK who work here have a second wife here apart from the one they have in HK. They are "real players" and they spend a hell of money for these ladies (buy apartments etc...)

Is having a second wife part of of the chinese culture ?
Pls some advice...

Ciao Amigos

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by usexpat16 (679 days ago)

plural of wife = wives.

why do you need "advice"? if it is part of chinese culture, then you plan to convert into chinese so you can partake of this?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Jigglypuff (679 days ago)

Part of the culture? No, they're just men with lot's of very affordable opportunities. China is much cheaper than HK after all. Apartments are peanuts in CN.

(I am based in Kuala Lumpur)

Posted by maydella (679 days ago)

usex: thanks for the spelling advice . But you didn t get (?) / or try to answer the question...

jiggly: my neighbour (a HK local) just bought his 2nd wife a flat for 600k RMB...no peanuts at least for me...so I don t think this phenomena is only money related.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by aspect (678 days ago)

its common but not part of our culture. The same condition applies to european/american male expats too and its more severe since, they have at LEAST one gal friend at each town and they use the company housing allowances in doing so.

those who buy wives are not real players, "real suckers" instead, becos those wives have their local boyfriends too.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Chang (678 days ago)

It is certainly part of Thai culture to have a "mia noi".

One Thai woman is more than I can take - having two would drive me nuts.

(I am based in Bangkok)

Posted by maydella (678 days ago)

dear aspect:
a guai lo don t have a gal in every city, he has a gal in every street as we all know. So pls no disgrace to minorities!

Seriously:
I didn t ask who is worser or better since there won t be a useful answer.

I just opened my eyes and saw that there is a part of the town which is full of 2nd wives sponsered by HK locals.

I heard this is part of chinese tradition or culture, therefore my question.

Pls stay to the topic...

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by aspect (678 days ago)

i think i did answer your question.
1. Its common but not part of chinese culture.
2. Its common to american and european, would you consider that as part of american/european culture? The answer is an obvious NO. unless you consider cheating is part of american/european culture.
3. Chinese tradition is having wifes under the same roof. Nothing to do with cheating.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Jigglypuff (678 days ago)

600k can't buy a shoebox in HK. And you're right it's not about money, it's about a fully-serviced home from home and not having to hunt (and pay) for cheap sex everytime they're in China.

(I am based in Kuala Lumpur)

Posted by shaq (678 days ago)

The last time I did a little (unscientific) survey, I realised The wife II (on the mainland) issue has nothing to do with culture, but a current trend being propelled by the lack of sexual attention or experience (coupled with the insatiable needs) on the part of most local HK ladies.

From what I've gathered most of the mainland 'chicks' are submissive and give the HK guys all the 'attention' they need in bed. True or False??? ... only those involve can tell us :D.

So 'part-takers' fill us in, pleaseeee!!

ShaQ

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Jigglypuff (678 days ago)

Shaq, could you clarify.
HK ladies isatiable needs (in bed)?
More submissive than the local ladies (in bed)?

(I am based in Kuala Lumpur)

Posted by shaq (678 days ago)

JP >> NOP,
I meant HK ladies insatiable needs for MATERIAL wealth (NOT in bed).
More submissive (TO A MAN) than the local ladies (NOT in bed, but could be possible :D)?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by maydella (678 days ago)

well OK than in comparison to thailand where it is part of the culture (thanx chang for your post)this phenomena (I call it like this because I never saw some kind of "2nd wife city" somewhere else in the world) has a practical reason.

But the place I am living here is only short distance to HK, these guys can go back to "home" whenever they want to get rid of their "pressure" with their 1st wives.
Another theory might be the they get it done better here than with their HK wives....but this is just a theory...

For me the case is closed, thanx for your comments.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by chonJAY (678 days ago)

women... sigh.... when will we be able to stand on our own feet and support ourselves, instead of selling ourselves out to the richest bidder for a nice apartment and new clothes...

maydella.. i think this cultural condition u have pointed out is disgusting... and sadly.. so true in our world....

i wish i could fix it, but until women the world over STOP GIVING AWAY THEIR POWER TO MEN... sigh....

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Rainy (677 days ago)

I'm Thai and would like to correct something here.. It's not a Thai tradition to have a second wife -- mistress. In the past, just like Chinese tradition, men had wives living under the same roof -- not cheating. All the wives acknowledged each other and devided the time to spend with their husband. To have a mistress is not a tradition -- and also it's cheating..

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by expatnchina (677 days ago)

Maydella, I have TW and HK colleagues and they all have girlfriends in CN. I always hear them saying it only for fun.

I don't think it's a Chinese culture. Men with bigger income = extra money for extra curricular activities.

(I am based in Unspecified)

Posted by chonJAY (677 days ago)

thats awesome rainy... as long as everyone knows about it.. its all on the up and up.. polygamy rocks! can i have mondays and thursdays with our husband? UGH!!!

expatinchina.. i love that.. so all men with bigger incomes have extracurricular activities.. kinda gives you a new outlook on the fairytale of landing that rich man to whisk you away!
maybe i should only look for poor men.. at least then i know he'll be faithful... right....

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

...until he hits the big time then what?

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by God. (677 days ago)

Yep, you're right, all my mates who work on either side of the border have a relationship either side (although usually one wife in HK and a gf in China, not two wives). They NEVER discuss the other (even amoungst close friends) whilst on one side of the border, so in China the wife does not exsist and in Hong Kong the gf does not exsist.

When I discovered this years ago I was very surprised but now I just know it happens. Prostitution is rife in Hong Kong too, but for some reason it is never clamped down on. There is a website that is one of the most visisted in asia (according to HK Magazine so maybe that's questionable) where these girls have photos and even maps to get to their locations.

It seemed seedy (and exagerated) when I first discovered all this but after years of being here I've come to accept that it just is and does. I just love my one fiance and keep my hands to myself (and herself of course)

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

Hey God,if you are he same god who wrote back in May,I thought you said you were getting married then and had the date and everything.Thought I'd just check.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by God. (677 days ago)

Yep it's me,

Unfortunately, my fiance's father went into hospital three days before the wedding was going to take place so we postponed everything. He past on two days later. Although it was a very sad time, everyone involved with the wedding understood and as she is Chinese we have stuck to local tradition to wait for 12 months until getting married again, but everything is just as it was before we just don't have the certificate.

I still love her to bits and we take care of one another, just have to wait 9 more months to prepare my speech (don't believe that here the best man doesn't do it!)

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

So sorry to hear that about your fiancee's father God.I was married in a Chinese ceremony,my husband and othe male family members had to 'pay money' to get into the gate.It was in Dongguan and the house was 4 stories high.My husband's friends all tried to climb the gate and two got stuck on the first landing they couldn't jump down too high and the gate has big iron spikes so they couldnt get back down.
They had to stay there for two hours before they borrowed a ladder from the Fire Station.It was very funny but the wedding banquet was wonderful and many great memories I will always cherish.
Your turn will come in 9 months all the very best to you.Sorry this is off topic.
Speaking of Dongguan,many 'second' wives live there very rich area,that house is my husband's uncle's house and he has a 'wife' in HK who nobody ever mentions but she DID come to the wedding banquet and most people had no idea who she was including the other wife because nobody had ever seen her before.Family secret and all that.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by God. (677 days ago)

Thanks Momo8, yes I also have to do lots of silly games to get past the 'gate'. I'm not allowed to know what they are yet but I've got a feeling it's going to need a change of clothes ...gulp...

(so we are going off topic again)

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

No not YOU changing clothes,the bride has to change clothes many times (that was an experience too) anyway send me a PM if you want a perspective from a western girl marrying a Chinese guy viewpoint.I can give you some pointers your soon to be wife may overlook.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by Rainy (677 days ago)

chonJay - no more polygamy in Thailand tho.. illegal now.. guess once the marriage license was introduced in Thailand, your name has to be on one paper only..

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

Yes but that doesn't stop 'girlfriends,lovers' and what men like to call them as secomd wives meaning lovers,girlfriends.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by momo8 (677 days ago)

Yes but that doesn't stop 'girlfriends,lovers' and what men like to call them as secomd wives meaning lovers,girlfriends.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by LostinHK (676 days ago)

Much more common in China than in the west. Fact. It may be not part of the "official" culture but its certainly part of the "unofficial" culture. A lot of the Chinese guys I work with tend to have mistresses.

Aspect is at it again - she better take a good hard look at her own culture. Many people here are obssessed about being "good" - yet as far as I can tell Chinese culture is just as adept as any other when it comes to being greedy, corrupt and full of badly behaved people. Its a tradition for the Chinese to also be widely xenophobic. Not all, but it does exist.

One tip for you maydella - when someone on one of these boards starts going on about how the westerners are all to blame or how we are responsible for all the stereotypes in the world - remember that it is a two-way street.

Don't get me wrong - there are a lot of decent people in HK and in China. But there are also a lot of bigots - its blindness to think otherwise. But I for one am sick to death of some of the crap I hear on a daily basis in this city.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by maydella (676 days ago)

LostinHK: "aspect" s anti guai lo point of view no matter which isssue is already well known on this platform. With her logic, she is able to explain even next weeks bad weather with the existance of guai lo s. I think no one with an open-minded thinking puts an emphasis on these statements anymore.

Back to the point:

Why many married hk locals have a second wife in china? part of the culture?

Why I involve culture here? Because its an open secret among married hk wives but out of any discussion in order to keep the family peace in an "artificial" harmony and not loosing face to friends or relatives. And this aspect is based in the chinese culture and makes it easy for a man to have a second wife without getting in big trouble ever.

This might be the explanation apart from being horny.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by rititt (671 days ago)

second wife, mistress etc.. it's not exclusively Chinese. It's true in any country, as long as you have the money to do it. In China, it's cheap to have a mistress so many people can afford to have one. As for the wife, if they are old and do not work, they shut up as long as they continue to get money from the husband.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Dutchman24 (345 days ago)

I feel compelled to weigh in on this topic. Conservative Christian Americans are becoming more and more polygamous (polygany). Most are very put off by the hypocracy of the serial monogamists and changing legislation toward gay marriages. Overall, I have observed this trend in Europe, U.S., and countries boarding the Med. Many Americans are visiting China for the very purpose of taking a second wife. I've heard husbands and wives talk with excitement about enlarging the family.

(I am based in Bahrain)

Posted by dolce (345 days ago)

For me, it's a trend more than a cutlure, maydella.
many local middle aged men or even elder ones like to have 2nd wives in China it's because in compare with their 1st wives, their 2nd wives are younger, sweet, tender..etc.
If they dont spend money on these so called wives...what's the point of these wives are still with them? Yes, part of Chinese become so rich nowadays, but there's the rest who live in the poverty!! Who likes to live in such a bad environment when you meet someone can improve your liveing situation!
it's the demand and supply theory!!

i hope i can give you a clue.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Teress (344 days ago)

Chinese Culture? Oh!no. Back to the real world now. Why they are not dare to tell their wives in Hong Kong if this is a real culture? I doubt this is simply some of man's nature. Of course not all men like that. I know some Chinese man very much love his wife & is faithful to his wife as well. But don't you think just some naughty man has too many hearts sometimes?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by cara_tanaka (344 days ago)

well,all of us have a deferent culture,but that is not about the culture,that is about of "WHAT KIND OF PEOPLE U/WE ARE"?well although u are american/europian or asain...have a second wives where ever,but NOT ALL!! remember,NOT ALL are DESAME!!! if talking about the cheating they wives or husbands,that is not about the CULTURE or NATIONALITY! that is what kind people u/we are,and what we want to do in our life...but before u deside,think about it,sometimes we need the symphaty for our husband or wives...lets think about if what they can feel if i/we can cheating them,well i have no husband or boyfriend now,but i want to share what is in my thoughs...thats all! and doing ur best for your LOVE ONE/SPECIAL ONE...

(I am based in Unspecified)

Posted by Markuk (342 days ago)

A good old 'men-are-all-b*stards' thread, blouses heaving, knickers twisting and hair-dos all increasingly dishevelled....

Jokes aside though, I've had same experience of seeing chinese colleagues with their peasant floozies - pretty much without exception especially as they get older.

I've always connected it to money. You can usually identify the rich here by their attitude and treatment of others. The chinese rich can also do what they bloody well want as well for no other reason than their bank accounts.

Give a man the means i.e. the cash, and the chance i.e. social/peer acceptance, to do what he wants...and..like all males right across all the species, it won't be long before he's red-faced, sweating profusely and lustily chasing after everything in a skirt and tights.

It's also very much a right of passage for the up-and-coming middle managers in china. It shows that they've made it to an extent.

This entire...social epidemic (?!) is well covered up by the chinese convention of 'doing' but never speaking of it - whereas in the west, very little is 'off' the agenda. That old chinese cultural chestnut covers a multitude of sins.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by Markuk (342 days ago)

Cara tanka>

No husband/boyfriend, you say.......? Where on earth do you all hide?

But that aside, I beg to differ on one point. This second-wife phenomeon (drawing a line here between extra-martial affairs generally) IS of a cultural nature - throughout Asia. 'Rampant' in fact. Nothing comparable exists within western countries.

Apart from that, I'd broadly agree with you....even if you sound a bit rabid with all those CAPITAL LETTERS.....

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by Mrs Miggins (342 days ago)

This is so funny. Often there are discussions about why western men go off with asian girls but then there's the whole other side of the coin with HK and Singaporean girls stressing over their local guys going off with mainland chinese girls. I wonder who mainland girls get the huff about?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Joe-GZ (342 days ago)

Mainland Chinese girls get all in a huff over other Mainland Chinese girls.

Second wives are simply all about economics. The women here know they have very little chance of making a life for themselves if they don't have a family with the wealth/intelligence to put them through school. And even if they do go through University only a very, very small percentage get a job where they can truly support themselves.

So they are encouraged by their families to use their beauty and youth to find a rich boyfriend/husband. Even if that guy is already married to someone else. They know this and they accept it. So it is incredibly easy to find a woman here who is willing to become a knowing mistress in return for financial security.

And when you think about it, being a mistress really isn't that bad of a job. You just need to be nice, good in bed and tolerant of the fact that you aren't the real wife. You get yourself pregnant in order to "keep" your job and in return you get financial security, a nice place to live and generally a nice (if sometimes lonely) life.

Much better than working in an office pushing papers for 1 or 2 thousand RMB a month.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by cara_tanaka (342 days ago)

hey markuk,
yes,its true i have no husband and bf,even before because i have a little bit scared to guy,and im not shy to tell that to anyone,but sometimes i just thinking to try to having a bf,i think i can not find my special someone yet,maybe soon...?? and im not tired to waiting for him,and also im still young,maybe,when im in 30 he's coming...hahaha!!!

(I am based in Unspecified)

Posted by GemmaW (342 days ago)

A discussion with my Shanghainese friends reveal that it is NOT just the local Hongkongers that take on mistresses or so-called "girlfriends" in Shanghai but just as many gweilos do it too. The difference is, in this part of the country, Chinese men outnumber Western men so they are often "seen" as the adulterers.

Almost all Chinese would disagree that it has anything to do with culture. Confucius thinking is long gone and is replaced by monogamy. That is why you do not see a married man in HK with more than one wife (as the norm).

I feel there are several reasons why people "cheat" more in this part of the world than the west:-

1) Divorce is still seen as an embarrassment to a Chinese family (even today). So perhaps they seek a "2nd wife" privately instead of a legal "2nd wife" through a divorce like they do in the West.

2) HK, being a developed nation is too close to China, an underdeveloped society, making it EASIER to seek such pleasure (for both Chinese and Western men). Try the same stunt and you'll be dunk in the West!!! In the West, the disadvantaged are still being assisted by the government so they do not need to become somebody else's mistress. The disadvantaged aren't so lucky here in China. In fact, the majority of citizens are poor so they see this "pleasure-giving" as an opportunity for a better life.

I do not agree with extra-marital affairs by ANYONE but I think I would be cautious with labelling ONLY Chinese men as adulterers or saying that it is part of their culture. I think both Western and Asian men are equally as likely to engage in such affairs, not one more than the other. Only difference is the opportunity - where one DOES have the advantage geographically over the other.

To Markuk, you are funny but spot on:-
"Give a man the means i.e. the cash, and the chance i.e. social/peer acceptance, to do what he wants...and..like all males right across all the species, it won't be long before he's red-faced, sweating profusely and lustily chasing after everything in a skirt and tights".

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Markuk (342 days ago)

Joe-GZ>

Yes, I never thought that far but, of course, there's wide acceptance among china's practically-minded wimmin for having a rich + married boyfriend. No shame in it. Still, make that a NOT RICH + married boyfriend and prolonged torture would fail to prize out such a staggering admission.

Also, rather than saying the trollopes need to be "good in bed" - i think they just have to be "in bed" (!).

GemmaW>

I do like your style. An abundance of keen observation, that, dare I say, I tend agree with.

Yes, the foreigner in China can run amok if you turn your back on him for 5 minutes, sometimes a lot less. The novelty of young women.....well...the novelty of young women...enough said...is far too much for the average middled-aged gent, used to spending his evenings contentedly watching A Question of Sport on TV.

Anyway, spot on.

I'd just say that I still treat the "Second Wife" phenomeon as both a mainly Asian affair (sorry for pun) different to extra-marital affairs in general.

Opportunity, yes, and casual affairs most definitely but far more Chinese men have "Second Wives" (with apartment, monthly allowance etc) than Western men. Perhaps I'm sticking too strictly to the Second Wives phenomenon.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by Markuk (342 days ago)

"Give a man the means i.e. the cash, and the chance i.e. social/peer acceptance, to do what he wants...and..like all males right across all the species, it won't be long before he's red-faced, sweating profusely and lustily chasing after everything in a skirt and tights".

Hmmmm...I'm not sure why I'm giving you girls useable anti-men quotes - god knows you lot have enough of your own and hardly need the assistance.

It's sad but true. You do get the odd loyal Western man now and then but not often. Even the seemingly loyal types end up having 'quiet' or perhaps more 'discreet' affairs. Funningly enough, now I think about it, such affairs ARE accepted by most other Western men. What men will happily admit to here without fear they wouldn't back home.

Oh god - I'm doing it again. No more Relationship threads for me. I'm losing friends fast.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by mjo (342 days ago)

Cara Tanka

You're a bit of a character. You sure it's not the men that are scared? No offense of course but you can come across a teeny weeny bit...well...manic sometimes. Still, the CAPITALS are gone, that's good.

At least you sound philisophical about boydriends etc and that's a great attitude. My advice would be to grab what you can and regret not a bit of it but as that's advice from a man, you've likely already forgotton it. Under 30 as well? Success all but guaranteed.

At 38 3/4 yrs old myself, I'm starting to get impatient for that lightening bolt to strike - even the odd spot of thunder would do, nice rumble or two, I'd take that.

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by hee larius (340 days ago)

why??......well its kinda like the same reason why a dog lick their balls.......because they can!

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by cara_tanaka (340 days ago)

mjo,
yes im sure that not the MEN are scared,why are u asking me that? well i can prove that.

(I am based in Unspecified)